Christopher Makins, president of the Atlantic Council:This is really a wonderful moment, and I am so happy to be here to greet, first of all, my good friend, the Romanian Foreign Minister Mircea Geoana, and to take this opportunity to raise a glass to him and to Romania, as newly invited members of the alliance..

Mr. Geoana has been associated as closely as anybody else with the transformation of Romania since the fall of the Iron Curtain and the collapse of the communist regime. He has held many, many distinguished positions both for his country and internationally as the chairman-in-office of the OSCE a year ago. He has distinguished himself by his acuteness of mind, by his charm, by his skill in personal relations, and I could go on and on, but I'm not going to because he has to leave rather soon, and you want to hear him and not me.

But I would just mention one thing to you all. I understand that, I think it was last week, he received the Romanian PASS delegation and instead of just giving them a briefing, he addressed each of them in the roles that they will play in the simulation tomorrow and sort of said: Well now you're the Romanian foreign minister -- what's your position on this? And I think that was just wonderful to enter into these events so thoroughly.

The other speaker is the former Polish Foreign Minister, Mr. Bronislav Geremek, a man of unbelievable character and commitment in so very many ways. He is a very, very distinguished historian of medieval Europe concentrating on the excluded and the marginalized in his historical research. But in the 1960s, he became a dissident and remained one right the way through the end of the communist period. He was one of the founding members of Solidarity. He was jailed for a year for the consequences of his doing that. He remained very active in the Solidarity movement right the way through the 1980s, was involved in its re-legalization in the late 1980s. He then entered parliament in the first free elections in Poland and rose to be not only the foreign minister, but also the chairman of the Foreign Affairs Committee of the parliament. He is a man of enormous distinction, and it really is an honor to have him with us today.

Minister Geoana and then Minister Geremek will speak briefly and then we will have, for as long as we can, questions and discussions. And because I also have to leave a little earlier, I've asked a my very good colleague and a board member of the Atlantic Council of the United States, Bob Hutchings, if he would be kind enough to chair this session from here on in

Mircea Geoana, minister of foreign affairs of the Republic of Romania: Thank you very much, Chris. This champagne really tastes good, my friends, and, of course, we'll try some Czech beer, because it's so famous worldwide. Thank you, Chris. I would like to thank the Atlantic Council; Tom Dine, an old friend of ours; and Radio Free Europe. I would also like to thank Mike Hudsel. He's a very influential person in the U.S. senate and a true friend of democracy, also a historian. And also I would like to thank Alex Serban, who is a young Romanian-American who decided to return to his native land to lead Casa NATO, the NATO House. And he was the one behind the presence here of the Romanian students, foreign ministers, defense ministers, secretary-general of NATO, and the like.

Let me tell you just a few things. Of course, we are happy and we should be happy. But this does not mean that we should not look at the world around us with realism and with the desire to see how we can move forward. I'm extremely privileged to be here and humbled to be here alongside with Mr.Geremek. The difference between him and me is not only the difference of intellect, in his favor, but also the difference of moral stature. This, my friends, here is a true freedom fighter. When I talk to my children, to my younger friends, to you, of course, I know that sometimes for most of you who have lived your recent years in democracy, freedom, and liberty, of course, the difficulties with transactions, with the anxieties, the challenges of this new Europe -- it's sometimes difficult to explain why it is so important to celebrate today the victory of democracy. Today we are not speaking only empty words about a Europe whole and free. We are also discussing the fact that the Munichs and the Yaltas of Europe are over forever. That the gulags and the concentration camps in Europe are over forever. That war today my friends in Europe is just impossible. And if you look at the history of Europe, I would say that this is not just a small proposition by any measurement -- this is indeed historical.

We also have to realize that we have an obligation to the countries that were not as lucky as Poland a few years ago or Romania today. To help them come back to our natural family of democracies, and we have to fight to get Europe to its original contour. This is not only about bringing freedom from the Baltic to the Black seas, as [U.S.] President [George W.] Bush said so historically last year, but also to the Adriatic Sea, because we have some business in the Western Balkans.

And yes, my friends, also to the Caspian Sea, because Europe really stops at the Urals. That's why Ukraine is important. That's why the Caucasus [region] is important. That's why our friends in Georgia are important; of course, our brothers and sisters in Moldova are important to us. Our job is not completed. Together with you we will have to bring this dream to become a reality for the other friends who were not able to do it so far. If they wish so, and they qualify to join the family.

Secondly, of course, the next challenge is not only about the future of your lands. Even if for Romania the future of this organization is critical. We have invested so much emotion, capital, and hopes in this alliance that we would not like to see this alliance become irrelevant or inept in tackling the security issues of the West. But if I mention the word "West" and if I'm saying with pride that finally my country is coming back to it's natural family, I would also say that our next struggle is to make sure that we are not just creating a huge dividing line between our West (which, thank God, we are on the right side of history this time) and the rest. Our friends in Eurasia and our friends in the Middle East, our friends in Central Asia, what we call the greater Middle East. If we speak about the West, we also have to speak about Islam, the roots of terrorism, about poverty, and about the haves and have-nots of the world.

So what I am just trying to say, as we celebrate today and eventually get drunk tonight for good reason, tomorrow we have to be sober again. And it's up to us, the people who are temporarily occupying important positions, but also mainly to you. Don't be indifferent; don't be selfish. Be generous. If we are more prosperous and more decent as individuals and as nations, this is very good and normal. But make sure that we don't make the same mistakes that were made previously in Europe or in the world.

Instability is still there. We have an obligation to bring the tortured freedom worldwide. This should be your message. This should be, if you want, your conviction. This should be the ideal of this beautiful and young generation, ladies and men together, that I'm seeing here tonight. I will stop here because I want to give Mr.Geremek a chance to speak and also to tell you that bringing my country back to the West -- both in NATO and the European Union -- was the dream of my generation. The dream of your generation should be to bring Europe to be the true global player and also to keep a strong relationship with America. Keep it strong; keep it simple; stay engaged. The world is yours. We are right, our values are fundamental human values, but we have to work hard to make them happen.

Bob Hutchings: Before turning the floor over to Mr.Geremek, let me just volunteer a small story. Ten years ago, when the first [U.S.] President [George] Bush visited Warsaw, he and I were standing just beneath the podium as the president was speaking at the Castle Square in Warsaw, and what you didn't know was the paragraph that never got read. In one version of that speech was a paragraph offering the perspective of Polish membership in NATO. The words were never uttered, because it was finally judged that the situation in Russia at that time was simply too delicate to throw a hand grenade into the international scene like that. So it was up to the next administration, the Clinton administration, to pick up this same banner and succeed in 1999 to bring your country in, during which time Minister Geoana, Ambassador Geoana, was working tirelessly in Washington on behalf of not only the Romanian cause but the cause of all those candidate countries deserving membership. So, finally, it was President George W. Bush who realized this final dream. This is a happy day indeed for Poland, Romania, the United States, and all of us in the Euro-Atlantic community. Mr.Geremek.

Bronislav Geremek, former minister of foreign affairs of Poland: I will begin with a personal small story. In 1989, [U.S.] Vice President George Bush came to Warsaw, and I was invited to the dinner. But I was arrested, and it was not for me to get the opportunity to eat a good dinner at the American Embassy. But Vice President George Bush declared that he will not see the next day General [Wojciech] Jaruzelski if I will not be freed. And so finally they permitted me one hour later to go to the dinner, and George Bush asked me: What was the reason given to you? Why did they arrest you? I said: They declared that I am a CIA agent. And Vice President Bush said: Yes? I used to be the chief of the CIA, and I don't remember your name on the payrolls.

Dear friends, you have two dreamers: Minister Geoana said that he was a dreamer, and I am also a dreamer. In fact, I would like to tell you only one thing: It is good to have dreams. Because dreams sometimes become reality. My country is free, but I couldn't imagine being committed to the Solidarity movement. I couldn't imagine that on 12 April 1999 I would sign on behalf of Poland the Washington Treaty giving to the hands of [former U.S. Secretary of State] Madeleine Albright the official document. And that was the happiest day of my life.

When I think on it, I have the feeling that on this day we obtain a kind of compensation for a very dramatic history. Imagine a nation that during 123 years couldn't have an independence day. That, after 20 years of national independence between World War I and World War II, was divided between two big powers -- Russian and German -- and after Yalta ... you know the story. I have the feeling that it's good to have dreams. It was absolutely impossible to think that, in our region, one nation state or one empire will disappear and more than dozen of new independent states will once more appear. Now I have the feeling that it's not only a happy day for my Romanian colleague and friend, for the seven [invitee] countries, but for Central Europe, for Europe, and for the world. Because it's an act of justice that now NATO is enlarged.

But the problem is that the future of NATO seems to be under discussion or debate. Sometimes even good news comes in a bad way. In the "Financial Times" you can find today a title "NATO is not dead, but is absent in action." But the problem is what we can do -- these new members of NATO -- in order to strengthen the alliance?

First of all, we had three countries accepted in 1999: the Czech Republic, Hungary, and Poland. We had to respond to the requirements of NATO and, after that, to present the message that NATO should be open to other countries in our region with the same historic experience and with the same aspiration for freedom and independence. And so now the very problem is what to do in order to give a clear message to the young generation of Europeans and Americans that NATO matters for the future, that NATO is not only a military alliance, but also a community of values, a community of aspirations. I would say that the fate of NATO, the future of NATO, is in your hands. That's what I would like to say to begin the discussion with you.

Hutchings: Thank you very much. We have time for only a very few questions because both ministers have to leave for other appointments, but I open the floor to brief questions. Please keep them short so that we can have a few. Sir?

Lucian Stefanescu, RFE/RL Romania/Moldova Service: Romanian Foreign Minister Mircea Geoana told us that Romania would try to play in NATO the role of a "Poland of the south." Which is the role the real Poland, that of the north, plays now in the alliance?

Geremek: I think that Poland should find its place in the north even after the enlargement of NATO eastward. I believe that Poland does not have to remain only a significant power within the entire alliance, but it could become a carrier of a certain new dimension essential to NATO, to Europe, as well as to the entire world. Poland, together with Romania, should become the carrier of freedom and hopes for an early acceptance to Ukraine, Belarus, and Moldova into NATO. I have the impression that in the past period, when a further NATO enlargement was under discussion, Poland did only what was necessary to do. However, now it is necessary that countries such as Poland or Romania -- and we have privileged bonds between each other -- that these countries introduce to NATO the feeling that it's enlargement is worth it, that it pays off.

I think that I can say it in French and you understand, but enough. I will say it just in some words so that the message is very simple: We would like to be in NATO, the message of this has very, very important truth -- that NATO needs enlargement, NATO needs to be inclusive in assuring the security in the region. And we would like within NATO to propose an eastern orientation of NATO activity. I mean that we will always present inside NATO the goal of Ukraine, Belarus, or Moldova, because we have the feeling that it's important for the future of NATO to take the door open.

Elisa Borghi, Italian delegation: Don't you think that a NATO enlargement should imply a modification of the decision-making process within the alliance -- meaning that the more nations in the alliance, the more difficult it is to reach consensus?

Geoana: I will take this one. That's a very good question. And there are people questioning with some reason ff through such a significant enlargement, the cohesion and the procedures inside the alliance will not be affected. We are also concerned about this possibility. I also believe that what Secretary-General [Lord George] Robertson is trying to do is to also streamline that sometimes very cumbersome bureaucracy inside the international staff based in Brussels.

I do believe that the consensus-based mechanism of decisions inside the alliance should be kept, because this is the essence of our alliance of free democratic nations. But if we are in the position to reach a political decision -- let's say, to react somewhere -- we should not preclude the possibility for a coalition of the willing inside of the alliance once we have the political decision to move forward. Because as Minister Geremek has said, through this enlargement, the NATO alliance is becoming more global. Of course, the newcomers -- especially Poland and, I would say, in the south Romania -- are bringing our specific sensitivities. Ukraine and Belarus for Poland; Moldova for Poland and Romania. But for Romania the Black Sea is also important. And, for the first time since the Crimean War in the 19th century, the Black Sea is becoming again strategically relevant. Also the Caucasus is important for us' the greater Middle East is important for us. So not for every single operation we have the same enthusiasm.

All politically support contributing militarily to an eventual coalition of the willing for one operation or another. But keeping the consensus mechanism, I think, is vital. The second important decision today is to basically move our doctrine, and even slightly our strategic concept, even more toward modern war, which needs to be fought in this new international context. This 21,000-strong NATO response force is a fantastic achievement. Because we don't need hundreds of thousands of tanks and old-style Cold War, Warsaw Pact-NATO kind of confrontation. We need flexibility, mobility. We need a certain stability, and I'm very proud, as a Romanian, that with our limited resources and with our sometimes severe economic difficulties, we were able to send 500 elite mountain troops with our own planes from Romania to Afghanistan and sustain them there in the first combat operation of the Romanian armed forces since World War II. This is a kind of coalition of the willing. You think it's important, you prove it, and then when you think it's really important for mutual interest or for your region, you also actively contribute to an alliance. But your question is correct, and it's again our interest to keep the alliance functional, coherent, and credible.

Agata Oblakowska, Polish delegation: I'd like to pose a question to [Minister] Geremek. In view of your negotiating experience of leading Poland into NATO, what could you recommend to our allies, friends, neighbors such as Ukraine, Georgia, Moldova? What could they do? What do they still have to do to enter NATO? And what could Poland do to help them to prepare?

Geremek: Is NATO able today, ready today, to fight global terrorism? The answer is no. Are we moving in that direction? The answer is yes. And I think the decisions today on capabilities, on this response force, are indications that we are moving in the right direction.

We also have some other evils that are fomenting and fueling terrorism directly or indirectly. One of the major cancers in southeast Europe -- Ukraine, Moldova, then through Romania, Bulgaria, down to the Balkans and then to the rest of Europe -- is, of course, organized crime. The huge amount of money that is laundered through organized crime is one of the ways in which we can really try to find a connection with terrorism. That's where we are trying to take stronger action in the region.

I think also that when it comes to knowing the Middle East -- and the greater Middle East from Central Asia to the Caucasus to the Balkans and beyond -- I think we are extremely good at sharing intelligence and working together with our friends and allies.

I also believe that we can start showing, by the example of Romania and Bulgaria, that no country is doomed to failure. If you believe in the right things and you do the right things and you elect the kind of people that you really feel can lead the nation, it can make a difference. And I think our countries can also fight indirectly against terrorism by giving this glimpse of hope to other countries. Some of them Christian, some others Muslim, some others with mixed populations -- they can really make it.

We can do this through military contribution, through fighting organized crime, through sharing intelligence, military or otherwise, and also through contributing to the construction of civil societies in the countries around us in the first stage and giving them hope. I was the chairman of the OSCE last year, and the most powerful argument I had in dealing with leaders from more complicated regions like the Caucasus or Central Asia -- and it was extremely strong -- I said: "Listen, if Romania can make it, why wouldn't you make it? Knowing the very low starting point that my nation, unfortunately, had after one of the most isolated communist regimes in Europe. We can do many things my friend. The only condition is to believe strongly in your values and in your mission.

Geremek: Let me say just two words, two remarks. The first one concerns the future of NATO, indicating that NATO should accept that actual challenges are global and it should be able to answer such challenges.

But we have some problems. First of all, the answer of the American administration to the decision of the North Atlantic Council concerning the use of the Article 5 was unclear. We have to convince our American friends that NATO matters in this new international situation, that NATO can answer global challenges. That's very important for the future of NATO. We should also, in order to give to NATO a new shape, help start a new European-American dialogue. The actual relationship between Europe and America is creating some difficulties for NATO. But I'm absolutely sure that NATO matters, and we should work for defining the new shape of the NATO.

As far as political experience is concerned, my first answer would be that new candidate countries should learn the Romanian example. And it's not a compliment. Romania made a tremendous work convincing all NATO members that Romania is ready before being accepted into NATO. And apart from having the military strength, it is also attached to democracy and human rights. My advice would be first to answer in a clear way what it means that countries like Ukraine declare that they want to join NATO. The answer didn't come until now. After the question, evidence should come. This evidence concerns the sate of democracy, the rule of law, the fight against corruption. That's the answer that matters in the internal NATO debate.

And finally there's the question of military potential. Now, a country like Poland is giving more than 2 percent of its budget to military expenditures, which is more than Germany is giving, than some other member countries of NATO are giving. The answer should concern the commitment of a nation to it's own defense and a commitment to the common defense, which means NATO. That would be my advice.

And my last one is that, in this very technical negotiation process, one should introduce an emotional fact. It's very important and it's important to convince our American friends, because they love freedom. And if they see people fighting for freedom, they are immediately for them. But it's important to NATO in general to say that it's not only a technical question, but that we hope to be together. We hope to belong to a community, which is not only a military alliance, but a military alliance based on a community of values. I think that that would be a good language, a good argument to convince NATO to accept new members.