Saturday, May 26, 2012


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French Constitutional Council Asked To Examine Armenia Genocide Bill

People wearing the Turkish flag take part in a rally next to the French National Assembly in Paris in mid-December.
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More than 140 French deputies and senators have asked the Constitutional Council to examine the legality of the new bill that makes it a criminal offense in France to deny that a genocide of Armenians by Ottoman Turks occurred a century ago.

Both houses of the French parliament passed the bill in recent weeks -- triggering a furious reaction from Turkey and threats of Turkish sanctions against France.

French President Nicolas Sarkozy has pledged to sign the measure into law in early February.

Turkish officials welcomed the referral to the Constitutional Council, with Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan saying, "I hope the Constitutional Council will do what is necessary."

France formally recognized the Ottoman-era acts as genocide in 2001.

The modern-day Turkish government denies that any genocide of Armenians occurred.

Compiled from agency reports
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by: Missak
January 31, 2012 14:24
Oh, that's right, what was I thinking. Might beats right, history repeats itself, Turkey continues the last stage of genocide...the denial and cover-up as well as the political pay-offs.

by: Karen Bedrossian from: Paris
January 31, 2012 14:39
Missak-jan, dont you trust French Femida? We can bribe French senators, we can pour free brandy to the Congress representatives in California and New York, we can buy corrupt Russian Duma members and their dollar-hungry colleagues in Uruguay. But we cannot bribe the French Femida. I totally trust it. Whatever it says, will be the ultimate truth. If it says the law is unconstitutional, then just accept the truth.
In Response

by: Mehmet Ozdemir from: Germany
January 31, 2012 16:34
Excuse me "Karen", what makes you so sure that the Constitutional Council of France will deem this bill as unconstitutional. Should you not first of all look into Turkey's Article 301 which criminalizes anyone inside Turkey for "insulting Turkishness"? I say, France has to do what it has to do, I accept the fact that there was a Genocide, and I admit it. So should Turkey.
In Response

by: Karen Bedrossian from: Paris
January 31, 2012 20:18
"Excuse me "Karen", what makes you so sure that the Constitutional Council of France will deem this bill as unconstitutional."

Well, Mr. "Mehmet Ozdemir", what can I say: have some patience and you will see what the Constitutional Court rules.

"Should you not first of all look into Turkey's Article 301 which criminalizes anyone inside Turkey for "insulting Turkishness"?"

Well, then after the adoption of this law France is the last country to criticize Turkey for Article 301 :)

"I say, France has to do what it has to do"

So has Turkey - by adopting 301 it does what it has to do.

"I accept the fact that there was a Genocide and I admit it."

Which genocide? Armenian, Turkish or both? Or maybe you admit Armenian genocide and deny Turkish one?

"So should Turkey".

And so should Armenia!

by: Nathan from: Haifa
January 31, 2012 14:53
France must demonstrate its consistency and honesty and recognize by law the Turkish, Kurdish and Azeri genocides perpetrated by armed Armenian bands in the occupied parts of Anatolia and in Caucasus in 1914-18. Armenians were not "angels" at all, they also committed genocide. And actually they started first to kill innocent Muslim civilians in the vilayyets occupied by Russian troops. When Turkish counter-offensice began, Turks took the revenge. Genocide in Anatolia is purely an Armenian invention. It is so simple: do not kill and you will not be killed. But once you get your lesson, learn it instead of crying for the whole century in different parts of the world.
Also, the following genocides must be recognized by law in France: Circassian, Herero, Namaqua, Tutsi, Roma, Bosnian, Comobodian genocides. Then the criminalization of the denial of the recognized by law genocides will apply also to them.
What makes Armeniann genocide so special that France recognizes it by law and ignores other cases of genocide? Only because there are a couple of more Armenian voters in France than Circassians?
The Herero and Namaqua Genocides were the first genocides of the 20th century, and they must be also recognized by law!
Armenians are by no means anyhow special in this world.
I admire honest French MPs and senators who challenged this law in the Constitutional Court! A big MERCI to them!!!
In Response

by: Grant from: Russia
January 31, 2012 21:49
What about armenians killed by turkish, kurdish and azeri "bands"?
In Response

by: Nathan from: Haifa
January 31, 2012 22:21
Yes, this also happened. But I say ALSO, not ONLY. Meaning, there were two genocides - Muslim (Turkish/Kurdish/Azeri) and Armenian. If you demand from international community to acknowledge Armenian genocide, you should demonstrate your impartiality and honesty and equally demand it to acknowledge also Muslim Genocide perputrated by Armenians exactly there and exactly that time.
If the law gets passed and acquires legal force, I will publicly make a statement in France that Armenian and Muslim genocides perpetrated each against the other were historical facts. Or will deny both of them. In no way are Armenians anyhow "special".
In Response

by: Ani from: Los Angeles
February 01, 2012 23:41
Armenians are not angels? What about Turks taking lands through genocide? How do you explain that? And what is so special about Jews that Germany recognized it, explain that as well. Truth should begin from somewhere, Armenia is the beginning for France. If you would like to know who killed whom, see who has land now.

by: Texas from: Texas
January 31, 2012 15:14
Politicians need stay away from describing historical event . They are the ones who make history happens. If you really want the issue to be solved make two side to seat at the table and talk about it. Both sides needs to bring their historians and archives to prove their side of story. Please politicians stay away from it. you are not helping at all.

by: Slava from: Odessa
January 31, 2012 15:16
Excuse me, Missak, but are you accusing the Constitutional Court of France of being paid by Turkey? I am sorry, but this is a rather a serious allegation. And unless you have any proof, I will urge you to refrain from making such statements. Constitutional Court is the last body in the world whom you can call corrupt, and Turks are the last people in the world from whom Frenchmen would take bribes. So, please be courageous and accept the final ruling of the Court!

Meanwhile, there are documents that prove that ex-speaker of US Congress Nancy Pelosi, who blocked the nomination of the US Ambassador in Azerbaijan Mathew Bryza, used to receive suspicious "donations" from an Armenian who was later arrested for the Medicaid fraud. Your compatriots in US were stealing money from American ill, needy and elderly people to "donate" the stolen public money to the congresspeople like Nancy Pelosi, Frank Pallone, Adam Shiff etc.
Besides, please look critically at your own history and STOP the Armenian state-sponsored practice of the denial of the genocides committed by armed Armenian paramilitary units against Turks in Van, Erzerum, Trabzon, Kars in 1914-1918 and against Azeris in Baku and Eastern Caucasus in 1918 and in Hojali in 1992.
The ruling of the French Constitutional Law will show to the whole world where the truth is! It will down Mr. Sarkozy into the barrel of eternal disgrace!
In Response

by: Hayk from: Boston
February 01, 2012 02:16
Azeris?
Excuse me Slava but Azeris never been nation until 1923 so chill up.
In Response

by: Pietro from: Messina
February 03, 2012 04:58
Well, the truth is: Armenians do bribe everyone for everything. So, they think or believe in their hypocrisy that all nations around do the same. What a shame!

by: François from: Paris
January 31, 2012 15:47
If this draft law is right, then US should criminalize denial of the genocide of Indians in America. Overall, this parade of genocides is the worst political invention of the recent decades. It has been promoted by terrorism. The French National Assembly adopted the draft law on criminalization of "denial" on December 22, 2011 - exactly on the day, when in 1979 an Armenian terrorist killed a Turkish diplomat in protest against the "genocide". In that respect, the draft law is also promoting terrorism as an acceptable political tool.

by: David Beck
January 31, 2012 16:11
This bill is a disgraceful attack on freedom of expression above all. The differences between Armenians and Turks should be settled through historical debates. And if Armenians believe that they were subjected to genocide, they should file a lawsuit against Turkey with the International Court of Justice in Hague. Otherwise, bribing legislatures of countries around the world is not really a decent way of bringing the truth to the surface. It is an attempt to push your opinion and silence the opposite view. The pain and losses incurred by both nations during World War I are being desecrated by such dirty indecent money-making politics.

by: Ba from: zagreb
January 31, 2012 16:32
by: David Beck
January 31, 2012 16:11
Reply
This bill is a disgraceful attack on freedom of expression above all. The differences between Armenians and Turks should be settled through historical debates. And if Armenians believe that they were subjected to genocide, they should file a lawsuit against Turkey with the International Court of Justice in Hague. Otherwise, bribing legislatures of countries around the world is not really a decent way of bringing the truth to the surface. It is an attempt to push your opinion and silence the opposite view. The pain and losses incurred by both nations during World War I are being desecrated by such dirty indecent money-making politics.
-------------------------------------
Well done! Nothing to add.

by: Hamed from: Turkiye
January 31, 2012 16:36
If the Constitutional Court agrees that this law is against the French constitution, then let it be clear now rather than later, because ultimately this law would have been challenged by Turks. If however, the French high court rules for the constitutionality of this law then it will be a tremendous blow to all those who vociferously attacked Sarkozy and the Armenians.

One thing should be clear to everyone, the passage of this law or its cancellation has no bearing on the factuality of the case itself. Turkiye cannot claim victory for having won the debate over the genocide case, it will only be able to claim victory for freedom of expression.

This, in my opinion an equally explosive issue and ostensibly a victory as well for Armenians, because now Turkey will be under tremendous pressure to abolish article 301 from its Penal Code and let Armenian genocide subject openly be discussed in Turkey without the threat of anyone fearing "insulting Turkishness" and being prosecuted for it.
In Response

by: Nejla from: USA
January 31, 2012 20:29
Are you comparing the Turkish penal code 306 with the automatic imprisonment and a hefty fine that the French law proposes? In Turkey, universities have arranged dozens of conferences to which Armenian "scholars" were invited. Even Orhan Pamuk, who gained from his famous declaration that Kurds and Armenians perished in Turkey did not go to jail. This 301 seems to be a crutch for the Armenians and their supporters!

Furthermore, hypocrisy nees to come to an end where the major Western/Christian countries are concerned. What about the French involvement in Indochina and well as Algeria, and the US bombing (along with England) of Dresden, and the atomic bombs that the US dropped which killed hundreds of thousands of Japanese in Hiroshima and Nagasaki? They could defend their interests across continents, but Turks were not allowed to defend their own land???

Anyone in their right mind is aware of the tragedies that befell the Armenians during WW I; but they also know that Turks, Azeris. and the Kurds were killed by Armenians as well..Where is the proof of intention, besides the forged Andonian documents, that the Ottomans intended to wipe the Armenians? An objective study of history will show that there was an attempt to stop a bloody war over some territory. Those who started the civil war in Turkey and Caucasus now cry wolf!!!

Nejla
In Response

by: Nathan from: Haifa
January 31, 2012 22:33
That's right, Nejla. For some reason, I don't see the Algerian Genocide among those that are recognized by France on the level of LAW. Sarkozy wants to fine people and throw them in jail for talking about dubious "Armenian genocide", but he conveniently allows his people talk about the crimes committed by France herself without any further punishment.
Generally, I don't understand: how is it possible to have a special LAW on recognition of a genocide? It is the prerogative of a court or tribunal (e.g. UN Tribunals for former Yugoslavia or Rwanda, etc), but not the parliament, which can be softly bribed by selling them your votes.
Imagine the stupidity: a country passes the law that God exists. Anyone who denies it, goes to jail. Doesn't this smell the medieval inquisition? Of course, it does. Or how about this: the law to recognize that cucumber is green, and anyone who denies it should go to prison. Isn't it stupid?
If there is a law on Armenian genocide (2001) then it should be amended with Turkish, Kurdish and Azeri genocides too. Or all the stupid genocide law must be repealed.

by: maja from: Polen
January 31, 2012 18:04
One should not compare French bill with Turkey`s §301. French bill will generate conditions in France, when the books will be burned if they have facts which prove that armenian "genocide" is a myth. Back to obscurantism.
What will be next move Sarcosys France to please armenians? Burn people who says that armenian genocide as an allegation?

At the same I see always that armenians in Turkey claim freely in newspapers that it was "genocide" without being arrested. Yes, Sarkosys France is on the way to obscurantism, I guess it just follows example of its little syster "Armenia" - so called Sarcosy Armenia to please armenian voters.

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